Wednesday, May 10, 2006

purbeck purity?

The Unfettered immigration of Foreigners into Britain.

On another thread this subject has been responsible for some heated and conflicting views. Let us bring it out into the open.

It is my considered opinion that this influx of peoples from foreign lands. (Any foreign land) should stop. Immediately. Those that come here illegally, should be returned post haste.

Those that have settled here again illegally, no matter the period of time, should also be repatriated. Immediately.
All criminals in our prisons should be deported, or stay in prison.

Before any one starts yelling Racist! This is the policy of the two main political parties.
Brian Guy

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Posted by Anonymous to swanage view at 5/10/2006 01:27:13 PM

117 comments:

nick storer said...

And not to be hypocritical if you ban immigration you would also ban emigration, Brian? In that way you could help derail foreign economies as well killing our own.

Anonymous said...

Not at all Nick. I am all for freedom of movement around the world.

But what I am not in favour of.... is the continuous wave after wave of folk that come here to take advantage of what we have, and what we fought for. (Industrially!)
Not asylum seekers. But economic migrants.

Though I am of the opinion that asylum seekers should go home and fight to change their country to what they want. Not run away to enjoy what others have done for theirselves.....

WE FOUGHT FOR WHAT WE HAVE! Why should we share it with those that are not prepared to fight for their ambitions?

With 60 million here now, we just cannot take any more in this little Island off the North West coast of Europe.

Anonymous said...

Should have signed it.
Brian Guy

nick storer said...

Things are cyclical, a few years and everyone will want to be in the Far East, India or the Baltic Tiger States where the economies may be growing much faster than here. Funny that more French people come to the UK to live each year than Brits to France.

Anonymous said...

I have to say that I personally find Brian's unfettered ramblings on immigration and immigrants tedious to the extreme and, also, not a little irrelevant to this site.

Am I alone?

Anonymous said...

As I remarked in another thread visitors often tell me they love the way Swanage exists in a time warp. Perhaps Brian would like to station himself in some prominent position, suitably clad, and give them the benefit of his views after all they are nothing but an echo of the sound bites and slogans of a century ago. Southwest Arts or the lottery heritage fund ought to be able to find some cash for this splendid piece of theatre.

Keith Roker

Anonymous said...

Canute had one or to things to say about waves. Boring racism and zenophobia from Brian really isn't representative of the views of all of us, but sadly too many will be muttering "hear, hear". Thankfully Swanage has more than one face and I know it can be a welcoming and warm place. I for one hold out my metaphoric hand to anyone who wants to make a life in and contribute to the real diversity of the town I am proud to call home.
Duncan Reddell

Anonymous said...

Sarcasm is hardly the basis to carry out a serious discussion about matters that affect our Nation, and Swanage increasingly as time goes on.
It has nothing to do with racism, it is the policy of our two main political parties. And a problem that will increase with time.

Duncan, holding out your hand metaphorically, is a great deal different to practical help.
Something that I spent years doing for the underdeveloped, Third World Nations.

As to holding out your hand? There are nine Afghans that claimed asylum after high-jacking an aircraft with explosives and small arms. Would you hold out your hand to them?
This national problem warrants a serious discussion. Obviously, not here.
Brian

Anonymous said...

Brian perhaps the rokers and storers of this world would act different if they let the gramar school site become a refugee camp, would you let your ladies wander the streets of swanage and leave your windows open, small shops would be picked clean, but wait brian lets hold out our hands and welcome these people.............ummm no thanks hear hear brian....and dont forget brian if you are over hear on a spent visa you could try and jump the transplant queue..... but shhhhhhh brian how dare you have a view like yours naughty boy it does not fit in with the spineless nanny stae we live in now ohhh tut tut... sorry about the bad spelling etc i went to swange secondary modern not the grammar schoool (refugee centre)

Anonymous said...

I too did not get much of an education, but thats no reason to go through life pig ignorant. The people you are talking about share the same planet as you and have the same DNA. You could have been born in a not so pleasant land. These people you are so dismissive about have different life experiences, that is all. Try to broaden your mind and realise everything that is English is not perfect.

Anonymous said...

There we are then....Anon says I must try not to be pig ignorant!
And I should also broaden my mind. Thats a laugh. For your outlook is exceedingly narrow.

While I my friend, have mixed with peoples from around the World.

One thing is pretty obvious, and that is your insularity from the real world.

Are you not aware of what is going on? Are you not aware of the dangers of terrorism that are here with us now, in the modern world.

Brian

Anonymous said...

This Alf Garnet stuff has to be a windup. Could its originators try to get something down on paper and we can try to make a show out of it. A few bright numbers along the lines of "Springtime for Hitler" seem to be called for.

Anonymous said...

We had 50 years of politicians and journalists building careers on the supposed danger coming from the Soviet Union. When that collapsed in a heap of rubble there was an awkward pause until the War on Terrorism was manufactured. It used to be reds under the bed, now its mad moslems. Wonder what it will be next. Martians?

Keith Roker

Anonymous said...

Hi Keith.
Then do you think there is no danger? Surely the bombings here and around the world aimed the West is sufficient evidence of a real and existing danger?

As to "anons" Spring time for Hitler. Hardly,the war against that mob cost me very dearly indeed, and still does.

The war may have finished back in 1945 but the results of it never go away, they have to be borne... to give folk the freedom to call others pig ignorant.
Brian

Anonymous said...

Its difficult to answer that in a few words. What do you mean by terrorism? One man's struggle for national independence is another man's terrorism. Most of the world's governments started off as terrorists including not a few that flourish their "war on terrorism" credentials at the slightest opportunity now.

The ejection of the USSR from Afganistan came about through US sponsorship of terrorism on a massive scale. Don't forget that the organisations that have now turned on the USA were in its pay then. No wonder the yanks got exceedingly cross with them.

There is more to it than the simple goodies and baddies categories the politicians and tabloids reduce it to.

Keith

Anonymous said...

I dont know how many people who came here to seek asylum Brian knows. I only know two. One came here from Hungary in 1956 when the CIA inspired uprising gave thousands the chance to get out. He was a teenager then, sent by his parents who dispaired of the future there. The other is a Tamil who came from Ceylon in the 1960s after he had been locked up for his political activities. He came from a wealthy and influential family who were able to get him released from jail. He took a course to be a printer when he came here but could never get a job in printing because of the endemic racism in the industry at that time. He worked as a clerk until he retired, living modestly as his circumstances dictated. From time to time he would phone me and despairingly tell me of this or that relative whose house had been burned down in anti-Tamil riots.

Brian of course may know large numbers of economic migrants who came here seeking "freedom from Want", to use the phrase coined by President Rooseveldt to define one of America's war aims for the post war world back in 1941. As its what he was fighting for he can't really comlain.

Anonymous said...

Perhaps a visit to Holland mind suprise a few they are struggling with imigration, and look what happens unrest and right wing parties winning big votes....... or is it just vangough who got stabbed? or was he shot ?

Anonymous said...

Racists stirring up trouble in Holland? Your answer- agree with them. No thanks. If you had been writing when the Nazis came to power in Germany you would be saying the Jews are a terrible problem- and that they must be because of the amount of anti-semitism going on there.

The problem is bigoty and intolerance not its victims. It has nothing to do with immigration. Genocide has gone on for a century from that of the Armenians in Turkey to the events in Rwanda without anyone having to cross a state border to become a victim.

Anonymous said...

I've bee away for a few days and have missed this thread - which begins with phrases such as 'unfettered immigration'

www.migrationwatchuk.org/

say: 'They are now less than 40,000 a year of whom only a quarter are given permission to stay in Britain yet only one in five is actually removed'

32,000 a year. Is that such a problem?

Anonymous said...

Thats a good point. In fact immigration has been "fettered" since 1905. Before then governments of all parties took the view that it was no business of the state to tell people whether they could live here. Throughout the period when Britain had the world at its feet anyone could come and live here. That ended in a wave of jingoistic nonsense and racial pseudo-science and the country has been going down hill ever since!

I meet foreigners who are working or studying in Swanage every day and I can only say the place would be improved no end if most of them could be persuaded to stay here and some of the locals shipped off to the furthest corners of the globe (if thats not an oxymoron.) This is an observation based on who I meet, not an opinion picked up from the gutter press 60 years ago. If some of the locals feel like an oppressed minority they might care to look in the mirror and ask themselves why.

Anonymous said...

Good to see some sane and rational comment in this thread. I'm sorry if Brian feels so insecure, but can't help feeling that he and people like him look back to an era which never really was so simple. It's really only the movies that were black and white, not real life.
Duncan

Anonymous said...

I still dont think a lot of people get this point its not a hate of imigrants it a distrust and worry of 1) how many and even, the most cynical of uou must admit space resources etc. 2)and what contribution they make to the whole well being of the country.
3) the inability due to the human rights act of actually sending them back when they commit crimes and scream pure hatered at our society. again a blunt question there is a lot of "imigrants" who have been here a while and openly advocate the destruction of our society what should we do with them? their families and other associates? Just because some people are proud to be from this area does not make us any less worthy of opinions and views, why dont some of you try and move to australia see how stringent their imigration is.

Anonymous said...

That posting puts it much better light than me.

I had hoped for a sensible discussion on the problem, and how it will inevitably affect the Town at some time in the future. Judging by some of the anonymous comments, with that sort of hate there is pretty little chance of that happening.

What I will not do, is get into a slanging match. Local folk are a decent lot, many with a long Country tradition of helping each other. Something I know all about.

Swanage and District people are the salt of the Earth. A kindly lot.
Brian Guy

Anonymous said...

The attitude of some of these postings is that their authors views should carry more weight because thye have lived in Swanage a long time. Thats as daft as saying the tube bombers opinions were somehow validated by the length of time they had lived in their home towns in the north.

If you start from the premise that local people are better than anyone else "salt of the earth" you can getto all sorts of crazy conclusions. If some strange quality of the locality makes people better that would be an arguement for inviting all the islamic fundamentalists to move here so their views can be changed and they can embrace sweetness and light.

Anonymous said...

who said isalamic fudalmentalist ? so all imigrants are these people then ? all was asked is wether people would welcome unregulated imigrationn in this area a plain yes or no the last poster is being racist by isolating islam !

Anonymous said...

Whats wrong with immigration? You talk about it as if it was some a problem. What about doing something about xenophobia and negative attitudes to immigrants? They are the real problems. Why should I discuss it as if it were a problem when it isnt.

Anonymous said...

If you think imigration is not a problem then sir/madam you are out of touch with a lot of peoples views and also views that are discussed daily by all forms of media and political parties.... again would you allow an imigarants centre to be built/converted at the grammar school site a simple yes or no? it seems to have gone rather quite now people are being asked this where are the open handed welcomes?

Anonymous said...

The fact that a lot of people have an anti-immigrant view does not mean that they are right. In this case the real problem is their attitude, not the object of their fears. Can you spell out exactly what danger is posed by immigrants.

If the Home office decided it wanted to build a facility in Swanage to house immigrants I would be in favour. Is that clear? What possible objection could there be?

Anonymous said...

So imigration and intergration is not a problem just a couple of quotes I would like to put up here and by the way these dont come from good ole purbeck boys can you then explain to me if these people are showing fear? Up to 300,000 Romanians and Bulgarians could come to the UK seeking work once their countries join the EU, campaign group Migrationwatch said.

It warned that Britain must not be among a handful of EU states to "go it alone" and allow unrestricted access for immigrant workers.

"Yet in the period May 2004 to December 2005 there were no less than 345,000 applicants to the worker registration scheme which applies to workers from the new member states
When we look at what happened with the bombings last July, when people were prepared to kill themselves in order to kill others, I think education can play a role in helping to get a better sense of what are the core values ... that cut across the cultures in Britain."

The government has previously said understanding British customs and history was vital for immigrants who wanted to become British citizens.

Last October it brought in compulsory tests on British life which immigrants had to pass before they could apply to become British
proves that it aint just me and brian worried I suppose these quotes will be attributed to the rag the daily mail....

Anonymous said...

The perpetrators of the tube bombings were not immigrants. They were English. They were born and educated in England. Why do you bring them up in a discussion of immigration? There was considerable discussion of this in the media at the time which you must have read.

Since Poland, Hungary and other east european states joined the EU their citizens have been able to come here, and there was a considerablee influx. The UK and Ireland did not impose restrictions on them. Contrary to the dire predictions a few years ago you probably never evennoticed they were here.

A number came to Swanage, Poles, Hungarians and Lithuanians mainly. some are still here. Tell me what problems their presence here created.

Anonymous said...

If you read the whole story re 7/7 and the new britishness quest you will see that it is of grave concern that new people in this country do not embrace or way of life or even our laws it not me saying this its a goverment minister, also 345000 peopl in 1 year expand that over say 5 yrs ? this country can not afford it either by housing, benefits and other resources, as I said these are govt figures and ideas NOT mine but what the hell you can blame me, after all you want 100's of these people in town.

Anonymous said...

These people? Which people are they?

Anonymous said...

I know people living in Swanage who are from France, Holland, Germany, China, Vietnam, Poland, Switzerland, New Zealand, South Africa, Sweden, Russia, The Ukraine, Cyprus etc. Some have been here for decades, some are recent arrivals. I have not observed any terrible problems caused by their presence. You obviously think they do cause problems. Can you please say what problems we have here because of these people. 5 or 10% of Swanage people were born in other countries

Anonymous said...

I just wish that "the politically correct brigade" would look at the first page, before passing comments.

Some of the postings reveal their own prejudices, rather than fair comment on the subject as it is presented.

That is coupled with accusations that have no basis at all.

Purbeck Purity has nothing to do with it. Surely, anyone that lives in the real world could hardly fail to read about the criminal gangs entering Britain?

Or the Highjacking of an aircraft by criminals armed with guns and explosives. Then to hold the passengers for 4 days under threat of death...When eventually captured to be set free.

On top of that, the ultimate stupidity of being granted political asylum.

I note that Anons response simgularly failed to address that problem, It was skated over, as was the case of the other criminal gangs that enter Britian.

I am not a racist, never have been, During my time I have probably helped more under developed Nations peoples than most in Swanage.

What I want is a British Society, the land we fought for. The land my friends died for. No more, No less!

We have allowed in far too many criminal gangs, and those that wish us harm. Is that fair comment?

There is something oddly familiar about the reaction here. Somehow it reminds me of P.M. Chamberlain's waving a piece of paper saying "Peace in out time"
Brian.

Anonymous said...

What do you mean by a "British society"? It sounds suspiciously similar to "ein volk, ein reich". You say this is not about race/ethnicity so what is it about.

Do you accept there is a difference between what you personally felt you were fighting for and the allied war aims, as set out from time to time by the politicians and reported at the time in the media. We all know defending the country against a German invasion was the top priority but I have never seen it suggested that maintaining some sort of national/ethnic purity for all time was among the other aims. Can you refer us to the appropriate document if I am wrong.

If you are talking about your own understanding of war aims I can only say that you were misled.

As for criminal gangs, well we have never been short of the domestic variety. The drug baron who was sentenced the other day had entered the country with false documents. Its niave to think that ant-immigration legislation would have made any difference. If these people want to get here they will find a way. If you make your living running a murderous gang of smugglers and drug trafficers you are hardly going to take any notice of the law on migration are you.

The case of the Afghans is not as black and white as you present it. They were fleeing from the Taliban regime. They were educated professional people who were part of the democratic opposition and came here because they expected sympathy. Shortly afterwards we invaded their country to remove the Taliban regime as it was a danger to the rest of the world, as you will doubtless recall. If a group of people had fled Nazi Germany in the same way I suppose you would have demanded their expulsion with no questions asked. They were not to know that government here is dominated by hysterical knee-jerk reactions.

By the way, how are you getting on with telling all foreign born residents of Swanage that they should not be here?

Anonymous said...

the last poster insults millions who died in the 2nd ww if the political views of the war differ so what hitler had to be stopped you sir are a coward to suggest the likes of brian fought for nothing. if hitler had invaded britain it is well doccumented that all males of age would be sent to camps so what ever the intricate details of the time mattered little . you sit here in 2006 insulting the lives of many who died for you sir, you have no moral fibre.

As for the afghans why cant they go home now then has not their country been rid of the taliban ? and it is perfectly ok to use threats of death and terror to get what you want... again that lacks moral courage....the laws ...not matter how unfair at times are here to keep some sort of order.

I'm affraid it is you who is out of touch there is a problem with imigration, we are not talking uncle luigi comming over to open a reasturant we are talking mass uncontrolled imigration, the facts are there dont please deny it.

Anonymous said...

For goodness sake Colonel Blimp read what I said.

Brian makes the remarkable assertion that the aim of resisting an invasion in WW2 was part of an ongoing committment to maintain some sort of ethnic/cultural/racial purity for all time. That is complete tripe and you know it. Within a little more than a decade of the end of hostilities a conservative government was actively recruiting employees from the West Indies. (Enoch Powell as minister of health to be precise).

I have come across this suggestion that the Germans intended to murder the male population before but I am afraid it is part of wartime atrocity propaganda. What is documented was that if they had landed in Sussex they intended killing the inhabitants of Eastbourne which would have been behind the invasion force as it moved inland. Beyond that the logistics get impossible. Who would have guarded 20 odd million prisoners? Why didn't they do this in France, Belgium, Roumania, Bulgaria, Poland, Denmark, Norway and all the other invaded countries

Whose side would you have fought on? All the drivel you write makes it clear that you agree with Hitler about rather too many things.

Anonymous said...

You Anon, besides not having the courage of your convictions by signing in, have also twisted the argument out of all proportion.

No one has said anything about keeping the country pure from other races. That is plain stupid and you know it.

What we fought for was The England we knew and loved. Our society. our way of living as it was back in the 40s. Nothing to do with what you are trying to suggest.

In that, we did succeed in lifting the black cloud of a medieval dark age from the face of Europe and its peoples.
So do not talk to me about racism.
Brian

At least have a little courage and put your name to your comments.
Brian.

Anonymous said...

Brian,

At some point in this discussion you said, very emphatically, that you had not fought for a multicultural Britain. The only way that can be construed is that you thought you were fighting for a mono-cultural vision of Britain. If that was not what you meant why did you make the remark? If you think Britain should be mono-cultural have the courage to say so. There are a lot of things in modern Britain you did not fight for, colout tv, mobile phones, fast food etc. You selected one aspect of modern life to comment on. What other conclusion could someone reading your posting reach.

Now you say you fought for "Our society. our way of living as it was back in the 40s". What do you mean by that. You said in a context of discussing immigration so I can only read it as a veiled way of saying that having fought for a society with few immigrants you think it should always stay that way. Explain how that differs from racism, or from Germans fighting to make the whole of Europe "Juden frei".

Anonymous said...

There seems to have been a remarkable range in what people were fighting for. Brian was fighting for society as it was in the 40s but an awful lot of people were fighting for a new and fairer vision of Britain and to that end elected a labour government on a radical platform as the war came to an end. There was general agreement that we could not go back to how things had been in the 30s.

Brian, do you mean society as it was in the war years or as it had been before the war. I would like you to clarify this so I don't get accused of twisting your words. Can you spell out for the benefit of those who were not there that the characteristics of this society were exactly. It would help us understand what you are getting at.

Anonymous said...

Oddly enough, even while in action there was talk of what we were going back home to..

There was a general beleif that the bad old days of massive unemployment, of near starvation in the inner cities and poor health would not be tolerated. Those bad old days were not going to come back....they were gone for ever...

It is not generally known, but many conscripts in Britain were of such poor health that they were deemed unfit to serve in HM forces.

They were in many cases so skinny with their ribs sticking out, that they had to be sent to a special centre to build them up.

As it was they could not even drill, they were too weak to march!

It was the better Britain that we discussed in the army "Current affairs" lectures and discussions. That was the Britain that we fought for. It was also the start of the Britain we have today.

Something "we" The British, built up, starting with a country that was bankrupt, and deeply in debt. A country with nothing left..Even after six years of war, running out of men. We had to break up units to reinforce others.

With all the peace time resources almost nonexistent. Coupled with the terrible fact, that the great majority of the thrusting young men that this country needed so desperately..to push us forward.. had been killed or wounded.

The mines had been neglected, we had no money to import food, and the Countries infrastructure was to say the least, falling apart.

It was the Labour Government that the Country turned to at that time. Despite all the shortages, No fuel, rationing, They pulled the country round.

That anonymous.. is what we worked and fought for. Now you can carry on sniping in your unpleasant manner.

Just enjoy what the sacrifices of others gave you, and protect it. For what we have here, has been fought for in this land..it is a precious thing. It is our Country. A country I am very proud of.
Brian.

Anonymous said...

Yes Brian, then commonwealth and Irish immigrants came and helped rebuild the place. I don't know why you have difficulty with that concept. Without them growth and recovery would have been a lot slower.

Anonymous said...

Jut a few more facts that will be unwelcome to the little England tendency. The population of the EU is 459 million, so taking off the 59 million who are already here that makes 400 million people who are perfectly entitled to move here tomorrow. Before May 2004 it was only 320 million who had that right. Now it is going to go up a bit more.

Why haven't they all flooded over here, taken all the jobs, drawn all the benefits, eaten all the Jaffa Cakes? According to the prophesies of doom we have seen in these postings we should be down to standing room only by now.

I try to post facts on here to counter mythology, groundless fears and sheer nonsense. I have often asked those who dont agree with me for facts to support their assertions but none have ever been forthcoming. What do they do, pluck opinions out of thin air? Why say something if you can't back it up with evidence?

Anonymous said...

Brian's last comment really touched me. The state that Britain allowed it's own people to get into was appalling. That's why I have such difficulty with the 'leave England alone' fraternity.
Arguably, England has only been anywhere near civilised since the 2nd WW.
For that we must thank those who fought for us - I wasn't alive until long after it was over, but the Labour Gov't - mainly voted in by those who had fought, was flawed but started to drag the poor away from poverty. As someone has already said that process was helped by immigrants.

Anonymous said...

i have given you some facts and figures, if you take your 300+ million there are lots of countries where those people are happy some ahuge portion of them will not come here but here dera friend is a quote from a goverment minister not me or brian or the good ole purbeck boys
A top Home Office official has admitted to not having "the faintest idea" about how many illegal immigrants are in the UK.

Dave Roberts, the director of enforcement and removals at the Immigration and Nationality Directorate, yesterday gave evidence to the House of Commons Home Affairs Committee as part of its investigation into immigration control.

Asked how many illegal immigrants are in the UK, Mr Roberts replied: "I haven't the faintest idea." He also revealed those who remain in the country illegally are not pursued as "individuals" as checks on such people are "not an effective strategy".

He said: "We are making huge efforts to remove them but not at the basis of tracing individuals". Mr Roberts was also unable to say how many people have been released after questioning at ports without any reporting requirements.

He said: "I can't give you those details. I do apologise. I was given notice but within the time available I was not able to find the answers."

Unless "individuals" are suspected terrorists or criminals, there is no policy to track them down, he said. The strategy instead is to target larger numbers of failed asylum seekers working for the same employer.

Meanwhile, the director of managed migration strategy at the National Directorate, James Quinalt, admitted National Insurance numbers are being given without checks on people's immigration status.

you will no doubt tell us this is under control and its my irrational fears and racist ideas but as i siad dear friend this is a top home office official......and the point about the males of age being put into camps is mentioned on a lot of documentaries, also curiuos you seem to casually say eastbourne residents were to be killed attrocities or what, correct me if im wrong brian were not the affen SS ordered to kill allied prisoners the brutal b£$tards they were?

Anonymous said...

Re-reading Brians original posting which speaks of "an influx of people from foreign lands" I was struck by how much the world has changed.

In 1938 the PM was able to dismiss Czechoslovakia as a foreign land of which we know nothing. You can now have a day out there from Bournemouth airport and it has become a popular weekend break destination. You can fly half way round the world for the price of a meal for two in a top restaurant. Keeping us all banged up in this tight little island and raising the drawbridge is a pure fantasy. Its gone the way of laws against things like cross-dressing or playing cricket outside your own parish on Sundays.

Anonymous said...

nobody has any idea how many illegals there are in the country. We've turned a blind eye to them in the past - when we needed cheap labour to pick crops etc.
Even if we did have a figure it'd be nearly useless, as there probably are illegal arivals on most days.

Anonymous said...

Someone has their knickers in a twist about illegal immigrants. How can the Home Office know how many illegals there are? Its a really stupid question. What are they supposed to do, have a Mori poll carried out.

Brian wants to make all immigrants illegal. He has said so. That way we will only get the ones who are prepared to break the law. As he would presumably like to make it impossible for them to work they would have to exist by crime. Very clever.

I am not going to trade atrocity stories but they do have to be plausible. Interning the entire adult male population is not. Don't believe everything people say in front of a TV camera. The Waffen SS committed atrocities, nobody denies that, and as is hinted at, its the smaller ones, like murdering a group of prisoners, that bring it home. The business about Eastbourne was told me by a retired British army officer who was born there and was taken aback when as an officer stationed in Germany in the 1960s he was shown detailed German invasion plans by the German officers he was working with and realised he would have been one of the victims at the age of 3.

For the sake of historical accuracy its worth mentioning that allied forces invading Normandy were under orders to take no prisoners in the first three days. Surrendering German soldiers may well have regarded being shot as an atrocity but the victors did not record their feelings.

On the other side of things, and while I am repeating peoples war stories here is another one. My mother was a GPO teleprinter operater in 1939 and 40. She was in the section that sent and received stuff from east europe and received the accounts from the operators in Warsaw of the Germans taking the city. This included a report that the Germans were shooting the boy scouts who had been told to put on their uniforms and help the defenders.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous...The ultimate untruth, is in your statement that for the first three days of the invasion of Normandy, no prisoners were to be taken.
That is entirely untrue. Absolutely false.

This is my final word except for this. Written by General Bill Slim, and answers the query "why did you do it?" from the Students of Bournemouth University

“If ever an army fought in a just cause we did. We coveted No man’s country;
we wished to impose no form of government on any nation. We fought for the clean,
the decent, the free things of life, for the right to live our lives in our own way,
as others could live theirs, to worship God in what faith we chose,
to be free in body and in mind and for our children to be free.”

I personally think this says it all.
That is my last word.
Cheers.
Brian Guy

Anonymous said...

"We coveted no man's country" How do you think Britain got an enormous empire? It took over dozens of other countries and imposed its chosen forms of government on them. In WW2 Slim served in India, Sudan and Burma all of which had lost their independence to Britain. Members of the independence movements in these countries may well have seen things somewhat differently from the general.

The British added various ex-German colonies to the list after WW1 under the guise of League of Nations mandates. By 1945 there was nothing left to grab.

As for standing back from religion, well, what do you think all those missionaries were sent to the colonies for? Teaching them cricket perhaps?

Hardly surprising most of the world think we are a nation of hypocrites.

Anonymous said...

"Suddenly, a young German soldier, about 14 or 15 yreas old, skinny and frightened, came out from behind some trees with his hands up, obviously surrendering. Col. Gavin looked at me and said, “Giblin, you know the order—'Take no prisoners.'"

quote from The National D-Day Museum Foundation in New Orleans at http://www.ddaymuseum.org/legacy/readstory/id=118

Do you think he was makingit up?

Anonymous said...

facts have been posted these facts and figures were issued by thei govt you just tend to ignore them.

Anonymous said...

I must have missed something. Going quickly back over this topic all I could see were figures for the number of Bulgarians and Rumanians who have registered an interest in working here and the number from the previous set of states which entered the EU.

If all the Bulgarians and Rumanians were to come at the same time and distributed themselves evenly that works out at 50 for Swanage. Why does this fill anyone with alarm?

We had an initial influx from Poland etc without anyone really noticing. You must think there were terrible problems- what were they.

I still don't know what was meant by a "British society" if it was not meant in a racial way.

Anonymous said...

50 more to be housed (just put my daughter down a few pegs then )50 morearound the doctors (see letters in this weeks advertiser) 50 more for the dentist 50 more cars? 50 more for the police/ambulance to deal with dear friend where does it stop thats just your 50 what about from outside EU countries, quote from france if islamic imigration is not slowed or stopped (bearing in mind the average children pruduced by these families) france will become predomently islamic by 2031..... mmmmm just think a nuclear power just a stone throws away Iran eat your heart out

By the way these are not my fact and figures, I have not just plucked them out of the sky

Anonymous said...

quote from who in France exactly? The national front?

Someone has already suggested we should appease the odious BNP by adopting one of their policies, i.e. banning immigration. Lets make sure we are not being asked to follow the line of the French equivalent.

The normal demographic pattern is that first generation migrants have large families after which it falls to something close to the average.

I am still waiting for a definition of "British society"

As you know, or should know, services are planned in the light of changes in population levels. More people coming here to work means more revenue to pay for improved services, hence in the long term immigration leads to better services. Do try to think these things through instead of sloganising.

Anonymous said...

you sir choose to ignore any facts and figures shown you, you just raise the tempo by calling all of us racist these sir are facts distrubuted by govt and respected agencies talk about racist being short sighted I think its your rose tinted views that are more of a concern than peopl like myself, who after all are only showing concern and worry at a certain situtation. a few more figures/quotes for you
It will also be essential to close off the benefit system, as for the earlier round, to prevent benefit tourism," the report states
adding to the work comunity ?

Identity cards and electronic border checks were hailed by Tony Blair as the way to combat illegal immigrants .

But he also conceded that nobody knew how many were in the country.

acording to some only 50 round here?
in France (which cant be called right wing) as we speak new imigration bills come into force as in holland,theres a backlash in these countries about imigration but no doubt all french & dutch people will now join us good ole purbeck boys and be classed racist

Just a titbit of irony for you the interior minsiter in france who propsed the bill is the son of a hungarian imigrant........

Anonymous said...

a few general comments:

Facts being given to us without the source. BAD practice. If you quote someone or something give us the source, every argument has, at least, two sides.

What is British society? C'mon stop shying away from the fact that British society is multicultural. Celt, Roman, Saxon, Jute, Viking, French - sorry - Norman, and probably every other country under the sun. Non Europeans may be a fairly new addition - does that have anything to do with this problem?

Veranda, bungalow, pukka, Chancellor, telephone, fax, telegram - all so English.

Anonymous said...

"you sir choose to ignore any facts and figures shown you"

Unless you state the source of the facts and figures how can I confirm their accuracy? An unsupported assertion is an opinion not a fact.

"It will also be essential to close off the benefit system, as for the earlier round, to prevent benefit tourism," the report states
adding to the work comunity ?"

What report is this? you have not told us. I dont understand the last part of your sentence.

"Identity cards and electronic border checks were hailed by Tony Blair as the way to combat illegal immigrants ."

Possibly, but this thread is about legal immigrants so why have you quoted this. Its nice to know you think something is true if Blair says it so he can rely on your continued support.

"But he also conceded that nobody knew how many were in the country."

Nobody ever has know. But again its not what we are talking about here.

"acording to some only 50 round here?"

Nobody has said there are 50 illegal immigrants round here. You, or another poster said that 300,000 Bulgarians and Rumanians had registered so that they could work here legally. I did not question the figure, or its source. I worked out that if they all came over at the same time and spread themselves around that would mean 50 in Swanage. It looks as if you dont know the differnence between legal and illegal, the present and the future.

"theres a backlash in these countries about imigration"

originating from the far right as it happens. Doesnt mean we have to agree with it or appease these people. Blair is an appeaser. So on this issue was Margaret Thatcher if you recall "some people are rather worried..."

"Just a titbit of irony for you the interior minsiter in france who propsed the bill is the son of a hungarian imigrant......."

Doesn't make him right. Having a Rumanian dad did not make Michael Howard right on this issue either. He positioned the tory party to the right in the hope of picking up BNP votes. Thats how politics works.

As regards racism, its the effect which is racist, whether those demanding the policies are aware of it or not.

If it looks like a duck, waddles like a duck and quacks like a duck then generally speaking it is a duck.

There was a similar scare just overa century ago. Here is a quote about it from Wikipedia:

"Yellow Peril (sometimes Yellow Terror) was a phrase that originated in the late 19th century with greater immigration of Chinese and Japanese laborers to various Western countries, notably the United States. The term, a color metaphor for race refers to the skin color of east Asians, and the fear that the mass immigration of Asians threatened white wages, standards of living and indeed, civilization itself. The phrase "yellow peril" was common in the newspapers owned by William Randolph Hearst."

The more things change the more they stay the same. (Thought I had better say thatin English in these circles)

Anonymous said...

I read this from a young man on another site. From where we are here in the Purbeck, we have little knowledge of the increasing frustration that some people have to live under. You may or may not find it illuminating.

And I quote: I used to see Churches on the skyline, from my house in all directions, all I see is Islamic buildings. And I am trying to figure out how these people can visit these places so many times in the day. My employer would not let me visit a church.

I guess a lot of it is to do with where you live in the country too. If you live in the countryside and you don't run into to many mosques, and you don't grow up hearing "Kill whitey" every 5 minutes, then I guess you don't really see a problem. I feel that past generations were nice enough to accommodate these people, and then suddenly they group together to attack us.

Anonymous said...

As to that last comment, not all of us namby pamby lefties have lived in swanage all our lives. I may have been born here, but have spent tonnes of time on London, Leicester, lived in Cambridge and Yorkshire. I've travelled a fair bit in Europe and the only city I've ever felt frightened was Leeds. The people who made me feel like that were white.

Anonymous said...

"I read this from a young man on another site"

What site? Its a waste of time quoting something like that if you dont give the URL. Its lesson 1.

Anonymous said...

zzzzz…………

Anonymous said...

Come, Come Now!
Do try to keep up. There's a good fellow....

Anonymous said...

Interesting, the reference to the Namby-Pamby lefties …anyone any idea who they are. In my younger days I will readily admit to always voting Calathumpian. Very rewarding.

I did dally with the “Die kleine braune Gesch√§ftsumschlagpartei” for a while, found I could not get in on it myself, so moved to the centre position. Sadly I found the deviant handbag fetish a very strange behaviour indeed, and not wishing to be tainted by this handbag abnormality. I got out…. For that perversion was just a little too much for this innocent and unsullied Dorset lad.

Anonymous said...

Again we hear from you where did you get your facts and figures! poster we get them from govt sources and others you seem only to willing to shoot down all these facts and figures you asked prove with figures and quotes we have yet in your stupid ignorant world yoy choose to ignore them and quote anti english propaganda its becomimg apparrent that what ever we offer up as facts and opinions from around europe you just shout racist racist racist. I only hope sir that you one day look back on this and say if only. enjoy Im moving on you left wing middle class idiots have due to treating all and sundry have won this round god I feel sorry for you sir or should I say mohamd I feel soory for you

Anonymous said...

The story so far:

Brian thinks immigration should be made illegal because immigrants want to come here to enjoy the benefits he fought for in WW2 and after. They include freedom, democracy, the NHS etc. which together constitute "British society" and immigrants would use them all up. He has explained that it has nothing to do with ethnicity but he does not explain how the supply of these values and services can rise with natural population increase but not with population increase through immigration.

Anon comes at it from a completely different direction. He thinks immigration should be made illegal because immigrants want to come here with the aim of destroying "British society" as they don't approve of freedom, democracy etc. They are not interested in partaking of its benefits. What he has said is that they think they should be able to help themselves to what they like and so they wish to leave countries devoid of law and order to come to one swarming with policemen to begin the difficult task of making it like the places they have left. He does not delve into why they have set themselves this uphill task. He also stoutly maintains that it has nothing to do with ethnicity although he talks exclusively about Moslems immigrants.

Anonymous said...

I was quite enjoying these exchanges although the islamo-phobia is a bit tedious. I don't know why telling us the exact sources for the "facts" you put forward has been such a problem. Its simple enough to copy and paste the name of a website or give us a book title. I take it you formed your opinions without going to the trouble of checking the reliability the "facts" you were presented with which explains why they are so far from reality.

Your condescending tone can be irritating as can the sexism of assuming I am male.

Its a pity you dismiss criticism of anything or anyone British as "anti-british propaganda" but happily swallow unlimited amounts of anti-immigrant propaganda because it suits your distorted perspective.

Anonymous said...

It is very difficult to distinguish who is posting. If you do not have the courage to sign your name.. through an unfounded fear. Then at least use a pseudonym.
At present it is not possible to answer a specific posting.

Anonymous said...

all those quotes and facts were on/in the news in the last few days i pasted them from various news sites for someone who alleges to be supperior to some of us surely you have read these headlines after all they were the top news stories over the past few days, unless that is your rose tinted glasses need a new perscrition. and the point was being made that if you added another 50 and thats just the bulgarians how much strain that would add to the local area. I have decided to move on you left wing idiots just keep shouting and calling every one racist, but you just feul the fire by making decent hard working people out to be trouble, I will like 1000's of other wait and proveyou wrong. I see your point of view I disagree but see it, you call me racist and other things. by making those accusations you hope to make peopl social outcast so be it, I,m sure with that arogant attitude you will always supress opinions

Anonymous said...

Blind Faith

Isaw it on TV. I read it in the papers.
It must be true.
C'mon, mix your media. For everything you hear on one Channel you'll find the opposing view on another. Give us your sources.

Mr Anon - but not the original.

Anonymous said...

I dont know why I am accused of having rose tinted spectacles. I expected the opposite criticism, that I am terrified of a resurgence of fascism and a return to the racist politics of the third reich.

How do you think Hitlers lot came to power? There had been massive immigration of poor east european Jews into western europe resulting from a huge population increase. They looked different and spoke a different language, they had different food and a different religion. It went from a few people innocently complaining they felt a trifle overwhelmed to the gas chambers in half a century. It unleashed the bloodiest war in history. We have the beginnings of exactly the same situation with islamo-phobia now and I find it a great deal more frightening than the would be immigrants.

In the twentieth century some mainstream politicians thought they could ride this tiger to get into power, just as the tories do from time to time now. They were wrong. The tiger devoured them. There can be no appeasement with these evil forces. It was a straight line from "decent hardworking people" feeling aggrieved in Vienna in Hitlers youth to the final solution.

"History repeats itself, those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it." (Marx of course)

Look behind the current newspaper headlines and what do you see? A cynical exercise from conservative central office to undermine the government. A succession of stories planted in sympathetic media as part of a strategy to win the next election.

Perhaps I should sign myself

Scared

Anonymous said...

This thread would be even more interesting, were it not for the “way out” postings.
Any one in doubt? or is troubled with what is written here? should go back and read the opening of this thread.

What I posted in the first place here, is the policy of the main political parties. It is not in any way a BNP splurge, far from it. There is no way I can be accused of racism, having spent a considerable amount of my life by trying to assist third world countries to help themselves.

I am not in favour of giving them lashings of money. I am very much in favour of giving the financial aid to where it is “useful” And of passing on the knowledge and skills that will enable the third world to help….. Themselves.

I, like the great majority of the UK, wish to see illegal immigrants stopped and those that are here sent home. Should this influx of foreigners continue, then at some time or other there will come a time when they will want to rule and impose their way of living.
It is then that those that query “What is British Society and our way of life” will find out, sadly too late. For it will have gone, for ever.
Brian

Anonymous said...

The original posting starts "The Unfettered immigration of Foreigners into Britain."

It does not say anything about whether they are legal or illegal. Its a pity you did not make it clear which you were talking about. All the political parties are against illegal immigration but thats a truism. They are against everything else thats illegal as well. None of them has a policy of stopping legal immigration however.

Do you think that so many immigrants are arriving illegally that they will constitute a majority of the population? The estimates of the number here vary from 500,000 to twice that so it would take another 58 million to give them a majority. Or were you talking about legal immigrants and their descendants? Are you suggesting the expulsion of the second, third and susequent generations?

Anonymous said...

Please sign some sort of identification to your postings,it is so difficult to separate the postimgs.

If you are scared of using your own name. then use an imaginary one, like "Disturbed Purbeckian" or "Angry old Buzzard" anything!

You should worry anyway..It is possible to trace back any e mail or posting, if we so wished! But why bother?
Brian.

Anonymous said...

Actually Brian what you posted was your considered opion.
You added that it was policy pretty much as a footnote

Anonymous said...

Go back to the start and read it....where it reads "it is the policy of the two main political parties" Nuff said?
BRian

Anonymous said...

I can see that you never went to school under Mr Peart! Or you would be able to read and digest what is written.

Perhaps it was the caning three times a week that drummed the ability to read into us, could that have done the trick?
Brian

Anonymous said...

I rather like "angry old buzzard" although I am better known for my placid disposition.

Forgot to ask which immigrants it is who would want to take over. We have immigrants from all over the place and they have more different cultures and traditions than I have had hot dinners. All the fuss in this thread has been about islamic extremists. A little googling revealed that they enjoy the support of about 10% of muslims. In order for them to attain a majority we would therefore need an influx of 60 million extremists, with none of the moderate 90% coming here and no other nationalities entering the country.

The spectre of France having a muslim majority was raised in this thread. Even if the predicted demographic change took place French muslims would then have to develop a single political party, which they show no sign of doing. The extremists would then need to persuade the 90% who dont support them to change their minds and not to vote for any other party, for example, a moderate islamic party.

I expect someone will say this minority within a minority will take power by force. Difficult unless they have already taken over the armed forces; a completely barmy scenario.

Take heart from Gilbert and Sullivan. "Every little child thats born alive is either a little liberal or a little conservative." That applies to christians, atheists, buddists and muslims.

Isn't there a contradiction in saying immigrants come here because they want to have a share of "British society"- that for which you fought- but they also want to do away with it and impose the society of their native lands? Which is it to be or is it war on two fronts?

angry old buzzard

Anonymous said...

Reading and digesting what you said is not a lot of help. You said "All criminals in our prisons should be deported, or stay in prison."

All prisoners? What all of them? Even ones from a thousand years of Dorset stock (heaven forbid) All deported or in for life. Thats what you said. You never said "foreign" or "for the duration of theri sentences".

The latter is a bit of a problem as penal policy is based on sentencing people to twice the sentence they should have and then letting them out at half time with the threat of going back inside if they don't keep their noses clean. What do you do, give foreigners half the sentence or keep them in for twice as long for being foreigners?

I had a rigorous training in textual analysis from Jock Lindsay at Swanage Grammar School. A scourge of careless wording.

Anonymous said...

That keep them in prison, was part of the sentence about illegals.. go back and read it. Admitted my rather large fingers do hit the wrong keys sometimes.

Hang on! lets rephrase that. My large fingers hit the wrong keys so often, that when I look up at the screen I think, "Oh my Lord!" where did all that come from?
so many mistakes. But a 15 and a half stone bloke, you can hardly be expect to have delicate little fingers..

But I expect, and judging by the garbled stuff we get here sometimes...I am not the only two fingered wonder of the keyboard.
Brian

Keith Roker said...

The other thing Jock used to do was pound me over the head with my exercise book and shout "read your work BEFORE you give it in."

good ole purbeck boy said...

So again its all the tories fault is it? ecven tho lots of these facs and figures come from LABOUR govt figures, another quote from newsnight it will take 10 yeras to deport all the illegals..... not a tory splurge just a govet quote.. so sir you are saying that being here ILEGALLY is ok a simple yes or no will do... as a country we do more than our fair share ta aid others but I would prefer this money spent on this contries health and welfare

Anonymous said...

There really is a lot of hysteria about this. Lets put it in perspective. Some of my relatives used to smuggle themselves into the USA in the 1930s when they couldn't get a job here. They'd work for a while, save a bit and come home or they'd be nicked and deported. That made them illegal immigrants but I don't recall them having two heads and a tail. One of the more enterprising ones even did a bit of bootlegging when he was broke. He would hire a car in New York, drive into Canada, fill it with booze and then drive back. You had to be desperate to do this as the yanks locked you up for a good long time if you were caught. He would have been rather surprised if you had described him as a gangster but that is the sort of thing the papers used to say at that time.

Anonymous said...

Keith.

What I recall most from Mr Pearts schooling, was his calling the names of "Guy Suttle and Lucas come out here" whereupon he would whack us with his cane, three on each hand. The cause? The posh boys of the old malthouse...

Sadly, I could never bear to see the sun shine through the school room windows. I had my fishing gear stashed away up the cliffs. I must also confess to being an inveterate truant.... When the sun was shining on summers days. But for a young lad brought up here? Wonderous. Miraculous.
Brian.

Anonymous said...

It seems to come as a surprise to goood ole purbeck boy to be told that newspapers have political agendas and politicians pronouncements are calculated to bring them the greatest advantage. Thats how it is old chum. The number of illegal immigrants was never an issue until someone found a way of making capital out of it. The number of foreign criminals who were deported at the end of their sentences, or who were not deported was not of the slightest interest until someone thought of a way of using to their advantage. Now they are big news. Shed a little of your innocence, do, and ask who stands to benefit from all this. If its not calculation its opportunism but I suspect its mainly the former.

Anonymous said...

So its not a concern to the people who have been attacked and robbed by these imigrants ? the reason it was of no concern because we knew nothing about it as soon as it was people naturally were upset and wanted to know what else was wrong. Its a simple fact Illegal imigrants should be deported and in general imigration should be controlled. It is in a lot of other countries why should we be different. Was not Sharon Beshenivsky killed by illegal imigrants? then agin if she was not its ok then because they were just ordinary imigrants... A brave woman!

Anonymous said...

Oh. for goodness sake anon grow up. You knew nothing about it because nobody had figured out a way to capitalise on it. Now they have.

It presses a button and your knee jerks dutifully; "as soon as it was (known) people naturally were upset". Of course they were. Thats why they were told the story in the first place, so they'd feel upset. Crimes committed by illegal immigrants are the flavour of the month with editors. In a years time they won't touch them. Thats how journalism works. Years ago it was strikes in car factories. That was what they wanted. You could have a clothing factory out for weeks and no interest from Fleet Street but have the lavatory cleaners in a car plant out of the door and they couldn't get there fast enough to shout "reds under the bed".

At the end of the day the credulous take it all to heart, refuse to look beyond the headlines and react as they have been told to react. Newspapers are all about telling stories. Always ask yourself what moral you are being invited to draw from the story and why. In this case we already know what the moral is but you refuse to look behind it and ask why. Its just common sense to ask what axes are being ground or do you think British journalism and politics are so pure that they don't do things like this? Perhaps you do. To you its all black anad white, yes and no. You think that if its on TV or in print its a fact, a pure scientific fact, glistening, like a star on a frosty night, untainted by spin or political interest. No need to think, no need to analyse, no need to probe for the truth, its already there, all you have to do is react and react you do

Anonymous said...

Have you never known first hand the facts of an newspaper report? I am sure I am not alone in saying they are reported with flare and are interesting and imaginative to read but the "story" is all important for selling the paper, not the truth of the boring old facts. (that does not sell papers) The thing that really scares me is people like you believing everything you read and being a puppet of the media wipping up hatred just to try and put a Conservative Goverment in. I do wonder who they are paying to revamp their image this time and hope they do not take it to far I know they are desperate to be back but incitment to racial hatred like this is reminiscent of the Hitler years. Just blindly following the amoral journalists is just plain mad.

Anonymous said...

to be honest im getting fed up with some of you people, saying "grow up" knee jerk reactions" "dose of reality" I know full well that newspapers sell on sensationlism, but if you read govt reports (wel this govt is full of lies) 1st hand accounts etc you can peel back the truth. I have friends who have moved out of their homes due to huge increase in imigrant crimes, 2 years ago a lady i was talking to on studland beach was almost in tears illegal imigrants had moved in to her area a divers but safe area they systematically picked all the local shops clean, house break ins went up about 10 fold personal attacks and even 1 rape, they all had mobile phones and when she was working in a pub these people would just use the drains at the rear as toilets they were given house that locals ( and no not all white boys either) were promised. she says there are a lot of areas like this but never seem to get the press... she was a well respected middle aged lady who as she put it allways voted labour. If you do get thge chance to talk to people who have had theses problems you will get the real truth, and its very upseting.

Anonymous said...

Ah! A realist at last. Someone posting old fashioned common semse based on the real world, and not on political correctness.
Well said!

Keith Roker said...

Heard it all before. Exactly the same atrocity stories have been circulating for decades. Its now "illegal immigrants" instead of just "immigrants". How on earth could this lady know anyone's legal status? If you are an illegal you dont exactly advertise the fact. "Hello Mrs Jones, I'm here illegaly."

Stories about jumping the queue for social housing are an old chestnut but fly in the face of the fact that in the towns and cities where the immigrant population is ghettoised they live mainly in areas of private housing.

Anonymous said...

This is getting quite surreal. We have all these people with badges saying "illegal immigrant" phoning round, with "Goodness, gracious me" accents saying "Ahmed, come out of that house you got before anyone else. Mrs Jones is down the pub. We can all pee in her drains. Ho, ho,ho."

Anonymous said...

If someone is attacked and robbed by a thug with brown or black skin and a foreign accent kindly explain how the victim knows whether the perpetrator was born in the UK, is a legal immigrant or an illegal immigrant. Its unusual for a mugger to show the intended victim their passport before, during or after the attack.

Anonymous said...

"you sir choose to ignore any facts and figures shown you,"

"in France (which cant be called right wing) as we speak new imigration bills come into force as in holland,"

I have managed to track down one of the newspaper reports you have presumably referred to. It is in the Times of 12 February 2006. I don't know why you didn't tell us this in the first place.

The article is quite interesting and the whole thing is at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-2036103,00.html

To begin with the interior minister Nicolas Sarkozy is described as a conservative in the article so the posting is making a misleading claim on this point by saying he is a leftist.

The article says, "Under the new rules, highly skilled immigrants will be favoured over those coming to France to join (their) family."

As a result, the article continues "Muslim groups were infuriated, interpreting it as a blow to north Africans in favour of Asian job seekers"

It goes on to say that the feeling is that the French model of integration has failed by comparism with "the anglo-saxon melting pot" and the multicultural model.

So there you are, the French envy our way of doing things and want to have more educated skilled immigrants. Exactly the accountants, doctors and computer professionals I referred to in an earlier posting as being what Swanage needs more of. The centralised "make everyone the same" approach has, quite predictably, failed. Let cultural diversity flourish!

No wonder anon does not tell us what newspaper reports their "facts" come from if they misrepresent their sources like this.

Anonymous said...

Doctors? Accountants? and Computer experts? Swanage needs more of them? Come on pleae anon, try to keep up.
Swanage had more doctors and accountants that you could point a stick at. Why then do we need aliens here when we already have plenty?

Anonymous said...

This subject, it seems to me has run its course. It is now becpme very repetitive.

It also suffers from a a failure of the interested parties to put a name to their postings or contributions.

Any name! Mickey Mouse if you like, that serves the vital purpose of distinguishing one from the other.

Without some name, it becomes difficult to sort our who is who.
Cheers.
Brian Guy

The effect of that is that

Anonymous said...

If I say the typical illegal immigrant is a middle aged lady who came to visit relatives 5 or 10 years ago, took a job with a contract cleaning form to make ends meet and has been keeping her head down ever since you will no doubt say nonsense, the typical illegal immigrant is a seven foot tall nut case case who eats babies for breakfast and spends sundays breaking into vicarages so he can bugger clergymen's cats.

Anonymous said...

Blimey, aliens!!!

If I don't watch it a flying minaret will spiral down, I will be beamed up and out will come the old anal probes.

I'm sure I saw it on The Simpsons, so it must be true.

Thanks for the warning comrade.

Anonymous said...

Brian started this thread by reminding us that it is the policy of both main parties to remove those who are in the country illegaly.
Nobody has looked at what it will cost.

According to the National Audit Office each expulsion costs £11,000. The exact number who have to go is uncertain. Those who want to be rid of them say it is something like twice the official estimate of 570,000 given last year.
The expulsionists want to get rid of them quickly. If we take the higher estimate as being 1.2 million and they want to send them away in 4 years that works out at 300,000 a year at £11,000 each. Thats £3,300,000,000 a year. Incarcerating 300,000 each year, for say 6 months each while we go through the tedious processes of law would require the tripling of prison accommodation to keep them securely so thats a one off cost of a few more billion.

We can't expect the banana republics a lot of these people come from to welcome them back if they start arriving in large numbers so a huge number will be bounced back and have to be held indefinitely at a cost of about £100,000 each a year. (See the expose on this point in yesterdays Daily Mirror)

A tory government will not be willing to increase taxation to pay for all this so services will have to be cut. Better start deciding where the £3,4 or 5 billion a year is going to come from. Get rid if teachers, nurses, help for the elderly? Scrap the army? The lower figure equates to Swanage loosing £1.5 million of public spending a year. What do you want? Close the police station. Give up emptying the dustbins?

Its not going to happen is it. Nobody in theri right mind is going to commit political suicide like this.

The practicalities are a bit awesome as well. You build your prisons, can't just use barded wire and watchtowers or the international media will go on about concentration camps. Round up the first 100,000 or so and what do the ungrateful blighters do? Burn all these nice new prisons down, riot and generally make a nuiscance of themselves as they have nothing to loose. What do you do, lock them up for longer? As they want t ostay in the country they can play that game for ever. Eventually you get them on the plane. You have to use specialy adapted ones as they will smash up ordinary airliners and you fly them off, assuming you have managed to find out where they came from. Why on earth should their countries accept prison flights? Back they come. What do you do with them then? Keep a million people locked up indefinitely?

Anonymous said...

Amen to that last posting! You can almost hear some of the respondants on this blog thinking..."costs loads to lock 'em up costs loads to send 'em back...how much do bullets cost"
Duncan

Anonymous said...

The Nazis established that gas was cheapest.

Anonymous said...

Perhaps they can be persuaded to go back the same way as they came in? That cost nothing!

Anonymous said...

I dont care too much what happens to them. I am only concerned with the safety and happiness of our own population.

Anonymous said...

For God sake (and this is an athist speaking) "THEM" whoever "THEM" are share the same planet!! "THEM" are not something you have scaped off the bottom of your shoe. "THEM" are fellow human beings. You seem not to have any empathy with these people. This seems to be missing in this smug so called religious church attending town. (Attending Church does not make you a good person)

Anonymous said...

Actual sir the report about the french act was on the internet dated, 16 th may not feb 2006 so plaese get your facts right i dont believe that i stated the interior minster was etheir left or right wing all I said was he was a son of an imigrant.... i just see the irony there thats all... also im am getting fed up of we have heard all this stuff before I was speak only today 20th may to 2 people who actually live in dagenham they said (not me) that the imigrants into the area are destroying it it is unsafe to send your children to school or the park on their own I bearing in mind what a left wing cyniacl lot we have asked is this due to either pedophils or whites NO came the reply new located imigrants, these people are hard working londoners who with their whole area elected 11 BNP councillors when I asked why? they said soley due to massive imigration and the assiciated problems and a couple of interesting facts sir 1 local bnp councillor is jewish and some of their supporters are 3rd generation asians so please dont try and call them facist i think its you sir who have missed the point not us rational honest polically incorrect morons as im sure you think we are. Its due to you alleged educated people shouting us down that we are made to feel the outcast all we ask is taht our views are heard and understood fairly, not burried just because it seems not the correct thing to say.

Anonymous said...

Comrade, you have missed the point. You have been led down the garden path. Its not going to happen. Politics is the art of the possible and expelling all the illegal immigrants can't be delivered. Its an exercise in making the government look stupid.

Cameron will let you down. There will be a little window dressing but no more. In all probability a tory government will get all "statesmanlike" and legalise their presence.

Bush is in process of making the 12 million illegal immigrants in the US legal and is making tough noises to cover his tracks. Whenever there is a political campaign in the US our politicians ape it, this being the 51st state. Exactly the same thing happened a few years ago over welfare reform. Remember "working for welfare" nothing came of it.

You can post all the recycled horror stories you like, it won't make a scrap of difference to political calculation.

Anonymous said...

Now, Now, Sir/Madam, lets not be sexist as well as racist. I do believe that women can read and write these days and some do.

Anonymous said...

U dont care wether you say we can reprint these horror stories the point is they happening perhaps not in your shortsighted rose tinted world, but in the real world they do and the people of dagenham did something about it they put a party in that will listen did I mention cameron blair or whats his name campbell NO. but perhaps i and othgers will make a difference to the political solution by having a spine!

Anonymous said...

'Allo. 'allo. Ze zene ist ze nazi zection von hell.

"Zo Adolf ze Englanders hav invented ze kosher fascism."

"Nien dumpkop. Mosley vas inventing it ven I was in mein glorious reich."

"But ze hav 11 kouncillors in Barking und Dagenham und ze viked socialists schweinhunds hav only ze 37 und ze tories only ze vun"

"Vunderbar"

Anonymous said...

Sprechen Sie die englische Sprache. Die deutsche Sprache ist nichts wie es

Anonymous said...

Himmel! Mien englander sprache ist nien gut.

Der schwartzer auslander unterpersonnen will you all kuchen und eaten und your daughters enjoyen. (Unterperson ist politishe korrekt, ja. untermenschen is inkorrekt.) You haf varned been.

Herr Powell of the rivers of blood gespracht im 1968. Vie ze delay in der flowing?

Anonymous said...

http://www.ifilm.com/ifilmdetail/2687980

Anonymous said...

The other side would probably prefer the E. Powell "Rivers of Blood" screensaver at http://www.sterlingtimes.co.uk/rivers_of_blood.htm

Its more to their taste. They might even notice their record has been stuck in the groove for the last 40 years.

Anonymous said...

perhaps the site blogger should laythis one to rest, after all the morons who have just posted are treating a senitive emotional and real subject with contemtp. its obivious that these posters treat all with utter contempt and think that they are they superior class. well good luck with it.

Anonymous said...

I don't think of myself as a superior class. Just NOT a superior race. Duncan

Anonymous said...

I just feel contempt for racists and their fellow travellors and for those who think we are so stupid in Swanage that they can pretend that they are not motivated by racism when they tell us that this or that group of immigrants are a threat to Britain's way of life.

Anonymous said...

Der fuhrer alvays spracht out against der decadent mittel klasses und der zoft liberalismus. For the ordinary suffering aryan people he always gespracht. Just like you. Ach, I am zo nostalik made by you.

Ist mein englische sprach gut now? Ja I thinking am.